Ebay manifolds

**arjunior45** · 04-04-09, 13:41

Originally Posted by Gery83

Had this before, but it was filling the sparkplug holes with rainwater.

It wasn't painted yet, just with some black primer.

Attachment 820

you could use {make} something like this in order to 'guide' the rain in front of the exhaust manifold.
It is not perfect yet but does the job just fine. Never had problems with spark plugs nor with the alternator or any other part, even under heavy rain or snow {not certain that much with the snow as we had snow for just one day}.

I do not know if the air goes out from this 'hole' of mine or if it goes in at higher speed but in the city I can see the 'heat' coming out from the bonner.

Nick

**Xti** · 04-04-09, 20:34

Originally Posted by Q4Jan

Maybe you over did it. Stop at sparkplugzone.

One thing i did hear one time(Actualy from someone who raced the 155Q4's) , is that because the 155 bonnet is lower at the front than the back, the air pressure over it is higher at speed than over a flatter bonnet. (Like an integrale.)
So when making holes, instead of sucking air out trough the bonnet, you would be pushing air in trough the holes.

But i find it a bit "whobly" theory. As getting cold air to the engine from above, below or underneeth will cool it. Might spoil the groundeffect, but as 155's don't have that......

Only thing to do is to find a willing suspect with heatsensors placed in fixed locations, and who has acces to two bonnets, of wich one can be cut up some.

I know i am not that person.

1. I believe that the Alfa Corse guys too must've had at that time some thoughts on this matter.
2. I haven't saw yet a racing 155 with holes in the front bonnet. Why is that?

3. It still remains interesting to me and as I haven't yet reached to a certain conclusion on this, one day I will have to try myself and see what happens.

I'm thinking now at just one hole (grid) at the back end of the front bonnet for hot air 'output' (the cold air input should be already assured at least by the OEM grid between the headlamps). We'll see.

Cheers,
Cristian.

**Q4Jan** · 04-04-09, 23:16

Thinking about this i remember the 155 gta.

Actualy the 155 gta had a very nice intercooler setup.
It was a big intercooler to the right of the engine. (standing infront of the car looking backwards.)
Straight pipes, and ontop of the intercooler was a very big carbon airbox wich got the air from the vents left and right of the alfa heart in the grill.

I saw a very nice pic of it somewhere....

The air to go into the air-filter came from the holes in the bumper.

The intercooler was from down front to high back at an angle. Like the integrale setup, but bigger with the top tilted backwards , and without the nasty bends in the hose.

Will try to remember where the pic in my mind comes from......

They seemed to get enough cool air that way, but i am also puzzled why racing 155's have no holes in the bonnet.

Maybe good cw values are more important than a few degrees cooling in circuit racing? Where-as in rally racing cw values are not that important.

**arjunior45** · 05-04-09, 20:51

Originally Posted by Q4Jan

Thinking about this i remember the 155 gta.

Actualy the 155 gta had a very nice intercooler setup.
It was a big intercooler to the right of the engine. (standing infront of the car looking backwards.)
Straight pipes, and ontop of the intercooler was a very big carbon airbox wich got the air from the vents left and right of the alfa heart in the grill.

I saw a very nice pic of it somewhere....

The air to go into the air-filter came from the holes in the bumper.

The intercooler was from down front to high back at an angle. Like the integrale setup, but bigger with the top tilted backwards , and without the nasty bends in the hose.

Will try to remember where the pic in my mind comes from......

They seemed to get enough cool air that way, but i am also puzzled why racing 155's have no holes in the bonnet.

Maybe good cw values are more important than a few degrees cooling in circuit racing? Where-as in rally racing cw values are not that important.

find this photo and post it here. PLEEEASE.

Nick

**Q4Jan** · 06-04-09, 01:13

I found it, plus one were the intercooler is missing to see the space available:

**Q4Jan** · 06-04-09, 01:22

Actualy seeing this not sure if it gets it air from the grill next to the alfa heart, or from the big tube underneath it..
Connected to the two cut out holes in the bumper.

**Q4Jan** · 06-04-09, 02:01

Looks to be the two holes in the bumper.

Everybody cutting their bumper didn't get it until now.

**Q4Jan** · 06-04-09, 02:35

So:

- move battery to trunck.
- make some room
- measure available space next to engine
- fit biggest intercooler possible
- make duct to guide air onto intercooler

Could make for a pretty fast Q4 without a front mounted big tell tale sign.

**jimnielsen** · 06-04-09, 04:44

They are great pictures, its very instructive to see how professionals turn 155's into race cars. Any more where they came from?

**Q4Jan** · 06-04-09, 06:32

Actualy all but the top one are from my computer. I saved all gta pics i came across for the last years.
(Although i am not to organised so they are in several sub folders...

)
The top one i found in the dutch "klaverblaadje". Wich is the alfa romeo's club magazine.
And they got it from the "il quadrifoglio", so at some point alfa romeo put it in their magazine.

Most other pics are form the gta's doing hillclimbs in italy, and i put the pictures here in wich some form of the bodywork is removed.

I have some more gta pics, but these are the most informative ones about the layout under the skin.

If i find something else i will add it.

**1NRO** · 06-04-09, 07:28

Top pics, a ducting master class

**arjunior45** · 06-04-09, 07:32

great photos guy. THANKS.

Well, the inlet manifold is at the same side!!! This manifold seams like the one of the grA grales and the ignition coils are definitively the one used on grA grales too - with the 'different' IAW I presume,used on grA grales too.

Very interesting the turbo location and the exhaust manifold. I love that.

Nick

**Q4Jan** · 07-04-09, 04:18

I really would like to know how much such an airduct would be.

Could also suck air from the right of the alfa heart. I like the "invisible" side to a mod like this. Plus our turbos are in a slightly different spot. So the same intercooler won't fit, has to be a custom one.
But really much much nicer than a fmic.

**arjunior45** · 07-04-09, 07:57

placing the intercooler to the gta position you will have the turbo and the heat coming from it too - too much close to the intrcooler! And if you do not 'insulate' the intercooler and if you do not make a box-guide for the fresh air to it, you will have exactly the opposite result with much higher air temp to the intake manifold.
You can see the alu insulating tape attached to the side of the gta 'box-guide' in this photo. It is there for that reason.

So, even if you move the battery you must also replace the turbine and I believe you will need to arrange another type and location for the water radiator!

And do not forget that gta has not any air-condition with it vaporizer and its tubes!!!

Relocating the turbine to the gta position I believe it is I good idea but what about the radiator and its fan?

Nick

**arjunior45** · 07-04-09, 08:07

Originally Posted by Q4Jan

I really would like to know how much such an airduct would be.

Could also suck air from the right of the alfa heart. I like the "invisible" side to a mod like this. Plus our turbos are in a slightly different spot. So the same intercooler won't fit, has to be a custom one.
But really much much nicer than a fmic.

what do you think of a custom make bigger intercooler {at + 47%} to the original position?
Something like the one on the photos attached, combined with the air water spray?

I'm going to test the water spray efficiency this summer {with the oem intercooler} and if air temps will be still very high I'll probably go for a bigger intercooler like this one. I do not like fmic too.

Nick

**jimnielsen** · 07-04-09, 10:15

i think it will be grand - if - you can get the air to it. I am also going to use a misting system for the ic - but with a front mounted one. I have also mounted temp sensors before and after the FMIC that go direct to the data logger so I will be able to record if the mist is making a difference - or just adding weight!

jimn~

**RMB-Racing** · 07-04-09, 13:01

IMO I think the GTA setup is outdated!

The car is from ?92, now we have ?09.

I have been in the danish streetracing environment (quatermile race) for the last 5 years, and here they are producing very very fast turbocharged cars.
Severel of them, is driving at "King of Europe"
And all of them - all - are using front mounted IC.

Take a look at the new Evo?s and Imprezia?s (also in the WRC versions) - are all using FMIC!

Why bother to make a design like the GTA, which are so difficult to make, when you relativly easy can mount a FMIC..?!!

You get so much more cooled air with a FCIM!

**arjunior45** · 07-04-09, 14:20

I know only one guy in Italy that is trying to make a design like the GTA. In fact he is trying to make and race a 155 GTA replica and this worth the effort - I believe!!!
Other way, I believe that the FMIC is a far better solution. It is just me that I do not like that much having 3 {three} 'radiators' {water, aircon and intercooler} behind the mask-bumper.

I agree too that the GTA setup is outdated! But, do not forget that this car participated the Italian championship for just one year {'92} and them replaced by the V6 TI version. It was never evolved.

Nick

**peter holst** · 07-04-09, 18:46

this is the mail I got from the guy from N-tecknologi. think that answers the question

Yes, I think so.

Regards

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Da: peter holst [mailto:ph@roisindet.dk]
Inviato: luned? 21 gennaio 2008 21.07
A: Marco Calovolo
Oggetto: SV: 155 GTA

Dear Marco!

Thanks very much for your answer. Does that mean if you were to build the same car today you would place the intercooler in front of the watercooler as most teams do?

Best regards

Peter Holst

**peter holst** · 07-04-09, 18:52

Marco also told me that they one used the integrale engine-compartment- design because they had no time to make another one

**Juan AR155Q4** · 15-04-09, 13:12

A bit late but I think that will be appreciated:

It?s from a guy here in Argentina, registered in this forum but a little shy to show his machine. Hope this encourage him and makes a good presentation topic.

**wrinx** · 15-04-09, 13:17

A very evil looking 155...I can see lots of cars moving out the way with that behind them!

wrinx

**Q4Jan** · 15-04-09, 15:06

Nicely raised hood!

**arjunior45** · 15-04-09, 15:10

That's really really GREAT.
Very clever the mod to its bonnet!!!
I mean this one

Sooner or later there will be a 'second' one from Greece.

To tell you the trough I did not like my 'mod' that much as it can bee seen!

Encourage him to make a good presentation topic - even with a hammer if necessary.
FMIC and the bonnet is certainly not the only mod of his as we can see.

Nick.