New rear anti roll bar

**jimnielsen** · 24-11-08, 04:54

I have had a new rear anti roll bar made for the Q4 - its a 24mm one as compared to the 19.25mm one that is original. It cost $270.00 (AUD). Also here are some pictures of the new springs that I have gone with for the front (D2) Struts - with the 'original' ones for comparison. They are 65mm dia / 180mm free / 650lbs/inch.

cheers, jim.

**wrinx** · 24-11-08, 07:07

Links don't work

That ARB seems very cheap...

wrinx

**Evodelta** · 24-11-08, 08:16

That should have some effect on the handling! Go careful in the wet, you'll be surprised how quick the back end comes around.

**jimnielsen** · 24-11-08, 09:35

here is another go at posting the pics.... hmmm. no - still not working.. And yes, I do know how to do it

**AlfaJack** · 24-11-08, 09:54

Try here temporarily if you like:
http://www.cloverleaf4.co.uk/upload.php

**peter holst** · 24-11-08, 18:27

is it possible to buy on of those ARB?
pictures please..

**jimnielsen** · 24-11-08, 19:14

http://www.flickr.com/photos/8634721@N05/

yes, $270.00 AUD is pretty cheap - it was made here - - http://www.pedders.com.au/products/56/138

at Pedders in Sydney. Postage out of Australia may be steep!

jim.

**wrinx** · 24-11-08, 22:30

Nice little video on their website...and the ARB looks great

wrinx

**jimnielsen** · 25-11-08, 05:06

some install pics attached....

the attached pics don't work either, for some reason I can't understand... so here they are on flikr!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/8634721...7609976576479/

**peter holst** · 25-11-08, 13:57

would it be possible for you to find out how much it will cost to send it to denmark?

**jimnielsen** · 25-11-08, 19:01

Peter - this is what the Australia Post "international parcel calculator" says - all prices are AUD.

Select Service Price
ECI Merchandise $227.50
ECI Documents $219.75
Express Post International $217.45
Air mail $212.45
Sea mail $96.35

jim.

**peter holst** · 25-11-08, 19:49

thanks very much Jim!

now I just has to see what that is in euro

**wrinx** · 25-11-08, 20:00

http://www.xe.com/ucc/

?40/€48 by sea mail...that's very reasonable! Is it similar for the UK?

Let us know how the car handles...

wrinx

**jimnielsen** · 25-11-08, 21:17

postage is the same for most of Europe - as far as I can tell. I am running the car again on the 14th Dec at Phillip Island - so it will be an ideal time to see how the rear bar works.

It is possible to have the bar made in a smaller diameter - ie - 22mm may be more suited to 'non-track' use. The 24mm bar is likely to be problematic in the wet - but I will soon see.

jimn~

**Stuntz** · 26-11-08, 06:16

Not problematic ! Yust more fun!

It will get rid of underster you will have to flick it in befor the corner and use the drive out of the corner! Classic Group A 4x4 driving style!

**Evodelta** · 26-11-08, 07:33

Originally Posted by Stuntz

Not problematic ! Yust more fun!

It will get rid of underster you will have to flick it in befor the corner and use the drive out of the corner! Classic Group A 4x4 driving style!

See how much fun it is when your car is wrapped around a lamp post.

**peter holst** · 26-11-08, 16:46

I want one if it goes well in testing - looking forward hearing from that..

**Stuntz** · 26-11-08, 17:34

Originally Posted by Evodelta

See how much fun it is when your car is wrapped around a lamp post.

Personal experience?

**Evodelta** · 26-11-08, 20:57

Originally Posted by Stuntz

Personal experience?

Of lamp posts no, but of oversized rear ARBs, how unpredictable a car can be and on track incidents yes.

For every successful mod you do to a cars suspension you make it grip better so you can go quicker around corners, this means that the limits of the handling are met at far higher speeds and when you cross that fine line you will know all about it as you will be going so quick and the car will let go so sharp you probably won't catch it.

Jim is doing the right thing by taking his car to the track and trying to get it to handle better, this is the place where understeer has no place and where you can experiment or get it wrong hopefully without it being a major accident. Usually you are driving here with 100% concentration all the time and can be ready for something to happen, on the road you aren't.

The increase in thickness from the OE bar to the new one he has is absolutely massive i'm talking a few 100% here, not just a bit.
To make a comparison with my Delta, I went from 15 to 19mm (which is a heck of a lot as 17mm is seen as a good uprade) and it can be a real handful in the damp. What happens is the front tyres warm up quite quick, but the rears don't, so the back end will come around at high speed and very very quickly too - I'm talking power slides at 100kph+.
I change mine from standard to uprated dependant on weather, not something you can do on a road car.

An uprated rear ARB on otherwise non modified suspension would be undriveable.

I don't want to P*ss on anyones bonfire, I'm just pointing out that Jims has to do his tests and report back and that a badly set up car can easily kill - especially on the road And we don't want to see any pics of banana shaped Q4s eh?

**jimnielsen** · 26-11-08, 23:17

Here is a link to a web page that compares the relative stiffness of anti roll bars. I can't attest to the maths underlying the input boxes - but it is interesting none the less.

....edit .... here is is on flickr, as pic upload seems to be broken??

http://www.flickr.com/photos/8634721@N05/3061726077/

The data in the boxes compares the std 19.25mm bar and the 24mm that I have had made.

jim.

**wrinx** · 27-11-08, 07:19

So you've nearly doubled the rear stiffness....yeah, that'll make a difference

wrinx

**Stuntz** · 27-11-08, 15:08

The question was not provocative but to explain what you mean! And yes i allready know all that what oyu have written but! An integrale is an unpredictable beast as it is from the get go . Q4 is more forgiving that is what i feel from personal expirience. He has gone a bit hard to the matter but the next step i think is to put in a rollcage. Because the cars suspenison and shell wont last long on racing tires stiff suspenison ARB. As you probably know if you would have the same kind of suspenison on a stock integrale chasies it would start to crack very soon! I do not know if oyu have driven a q4 but it has to be driven in different style as an integrale to be as fast!

**Evodelta** · 27-11-08, 15:33

Originally Posted by Stuntz

The question was not provocative but to explain what you mean! And yes i allready know all that what oyu have written but! An integrale is an unpredictable beast as it is from the get go . Q4 is more forgiving that is what i feel from personal expirience. He has gone a bit hard to the matter but the next step i think is to put in a rollcage. Because the cars suspenison and shell wont last long on racing tires stiff suspenison ARB. As you probably know if you would have the same kind of suspenison on a stock integrale chasies it would start to crack very soon! I do not know if oyu have driven a q4 but it has to be driven in different style as an integrale to be as fast!

I know you weren't being provocative and well, I did explain what I meant!

I agree with what you say too, not sure about "a Q4 has to be driven in different style as an integrale to be as fast!" though?

Do you think they are that far apart and why? Suspension is different of course, but transmission is basically the same. (as is the understeer on a standard car)

**Stuntz** · 27-11-08, 15:39

hard to explain integrale does strange things when you push it to the limit im talking about twisty narow roads slippy asfalth ( we have no race track to test ) abrupt braking out of the ass ! and such i try to kill you infidel moves! . As the q4 is more forgiving you know when that ass is going to go or when the nose will let go . Q4 shows what is it goign to do as integrale just does it ! That is why i do not like the integrales as much as i did befor i have driven it ( was driving an integrale 16v tipo cams else everything stock )