Worn lobes on exhaust cam

**AlfaJack** · 06-09-08, 21:54

The engine has a 100K miles on it, what would have caused this?

No. 5 looks suspect also:

I think I may have a spare in the shed but will need to check.

Will I be down on a lot of power?

**Evodelta** · 07-09-08, 09:57

It's a common problem with this engine and different people have different therories:

1. Not changing the oil often enough (not neccessarily you, but previous owners)

2. Badly set tappet clearances.

3. The turbo manifold runs close to the head here and the heat from it cooks the oil.

4. Later cams for these engines being made from bad material. Many specialists will not even fit a cam from Fiat believing this to be the problem.

5. A combination of all of the above.

Yes, you will of course be down on power, the exhaust valve(s) are not opening enough.
The worn cam is not the only problem, now you have to worry where all the metal went....

**AlfaJack** · 07-09-08, 18:25

Thanks, I will swap them out when I check for a spare in the shed.

Originally Posted by Evodelta

now you have to worry where all the metal went....

Yes this has been on my mind. Basically its going to be everywhere, I will change the oil now and again in a couple of thousand miles.

Would you recommend an engine flush?

**Evodelta** · 07-09-08, 19:10

If you changed your oil filter regularly then it may be ok, consider the flow of oil: It goes from the head down to the sump, then up the pick up, round the pump and through the filter before going further.
To flush just use some of the cheapest crappest oil you can find and use it for a short time before changing it and the filter too. The filter is the most important as that is where most of the swarf will be.
Never a quiet moment with an old Italian car eh? And if there is it's because something is brewing....

**T M Oren** · 07-09-08, 19:26

Been there, done that.
C&B cams for me.

Good luk.
It is an easy jobb.

I heard that Fiat tipo 3dor inlet cam vill do a god jobb as eksaus cam on the Q4?????

**AlfaJack** · 07-09-08, 20:10

Cheers.

Its an easy job to swap them but re-shimming I am not so sure how to do myself. My dad did it on the car I re-built when I was not there and the head was off the block.

Do I need to take the cams out each time to try different sizes? I have 16 from a different head. A quick guide would be appreciated if you could.

Nope, never a quiet moment, I only took the cover off to paint it

@TM, I have thought about doing the Tipo conversion (I thought it was a 5 door version) but I think I would need a re-map and I am looking for a quick solid fix for now.

**Evodelta** · 07-09-08, 22:10

There was a thread on here just a few weeks ago started by young Master Wrinks, tie that in with the w'shop manual and you will learn lots. If you don't have a tappet bucket depressing tool then you will have to do it by taking the cams out. Some accurate measuring equipment (feelers) a basic grasp of maths, a bit of patience, a soup??on of diligence and you will be ok.

**AlfaJack** · 07-09-08, 22:14

Originally Posted by Evodelta

tappet bucket depressing tool

Sounds good as I would rather leave it in whist I adjust it. Il get on to the workshop manual in my lunch break

**Q4pete** · 07-09-08, 22:37

I just had same problem with an Alfa 147, but it was twink 1.6!!! isn't case hardening great???
lack of oil changes was to blame in this instance!! A previous owner had not had it changed for a year or so and racked up loads of mile's!!

**Evodelta** · 07-09-08, 22:47

Originally Posted by AlfaJack

Sounds good as I would rather leave it in whist I adjust it. Il get on to the workshop manual in my lunch break

These tools may be available from Guy Croft.

Also useful is a tiny flatbladed screwdriver to flip the shims out and a magnet-on-a-retractable-1980s-car aerial* type thingy to retrieve them.

*Hopefully you know the kind of thing I mean.

**wrinx** · 07-09-08, 22:56

They are available from GC, for about ?50+vat+delivery...I posted about them in the cam thread I think.

Not got around to getting any yet...but I might try and manage without due to the price!

wrinx

**AlfaJack** · 08-09-08, 00:50

Iv got the magnetic aerial thing already, invaluable with the amount of stuff I loose down the back of engine bays!

Will contact GC..

**Evodelta** · 08-09-08, 08:15

You'll have to go halves with Wrinkypoos maybe. A turkey baster is a good cheap tool aswell for lifting the oil out of the head before you operate.

**AlfaJack** · 08-09-08, 08:49

Originally Posted by Evodelta

You'll have to go halves with Wrinkypoos maybe. A turkey baster is a good cheap tool aswell for lifting the oil out of the head before you operate.

Il use my brake bleed vacuum thing.

I was thinking about asking Wrinx if he wanted to go halves. But I will check to see if anyone is renting them for much cheapness on FCCUK first

**wrinx** · 08-09-08, 15:52

I searched there and couldn't find reference to even checking the clearances!

Perhaps it was just my search though...

wrinx

**AlfaJack** · 08-09-08, 20:01

Right, have had a quick measure up...in inches as I didn't find the mm feeler until after

So after conversion the inlet is all at 0.31
The exhaust is ranging from 0.36 to 0.41

I think these are a bit meaningless though as I really need to redo it properly with the correct feeler gauge. Then again, why bother, they are being swapped!

The manual states the range should be (cold engine):

Inlet: 0.36 - 0.44
Exhaust: 0.46 - 0.54

On the plus side my spare cams look good and healthy

**wrinx** · 08-09-08, 20:23

So they are all too tight...

wrinx

**AlfaJack** · 08-09-08, 20:39

Yes, but I would need more accurate readings with the mm feelers to be sure. As I am swapping the cams I will see what that brings.

**AlfaJack** · 11-09-08, 14:24

Bloodyhell, wish I had never discovered it (short term view). ?40 for 6 shims to be delivered!

**wrinx** · 11-09-08, 17:34

Ouch! I need some shims for the inlet so perhaps some of yours (if they're ok) will be of use to me...to help reduce the cost

wrinx

**T M Oren** · 11-09-08, 19:31

@TM, I have thought about doing the Tipo conversion (I thought it was a 5 door version) but I think I would need a re-map and I am looking for a quick solid fix for now.

OOOOOOOOOOOPS !!!!!!
Do`t listen too me.
I do`t remember.
Sorry!!!!!

**arjunior45** · 12-09-08, 08:51

Originally Posted by wrinx

Ouch! I need some shims for the inlet so perhaps some of yours (if they're ok) will be of use to me...to help reduce the cost

wrinx

sorry wrinx, do not have any. And I do not know how much they cost here in Greece.

Nick

**wrinx** · 12-09-08, 09:27

No problem, quite happy to buy new but thought I might be able to help Jack out

wrinx

**arjunior45** · 12-09-08, 09:30

some day I must check my valve's clearance too as its quite some time they've started to 'make their noise'. Hope to mount the Tipo cam too at that time.
BTW it's the 5 door Tipo's cam, but to be sure you must measure the lift of them. It should be 10,115mm.

Nick

**AlfaJack** · 12-09-08, 12:12

Might be able to help you out Wrinx, just let me know the numbers.

For the Tipo cam you need to cut the off centre slot for the cam phase sensor on the exhaust side..

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