If you have two pipes instead of four you will need less room no?Quote:
Originally Posted by Juan AR155Q4
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If you have two pipes instead of four you will need less room no?Quote:
Originally Posted by Juan AR155Q4
It is used in cast iron OEM manifolds, like the SAAB 9-5 and old 9-3, not the GM engine. Probably also in many other modern engines. I have asked my friend for a picture and he should look for a picture or get one, but it could take some days since he was out of workshop/work for some days.
You will gain som space in the engine compartment, which of course is positive, but the major argument is less volume in the manifold itself.
You mean this one?
Yes I do.
And here comes the pictures from MrNick on this forum. As he says to me, there are certainly a lot of critics that could be rised against the diffrence in pipe length and maybe also the design. But it is proven to work very well on both Cosworths and Integrales etc. The last time I asked about the price, it was ?450 for std steel and ?550 for stainless steel.
And besides. There is a reason to why SAAB has that design. It is probably the best 4-cylinder design you can cast. The higher rpm you optimise at the less important is it to keep down the volume and the more important it is to optimise flow properties, but the design shown is used on many high performing Deltas and Cosworths - where Spaghetti-manifold has been tested as well.
I found these pictures from the Saab 900, 9-3 and 9-5 exhaust manifold!
I do not think it's the same as the one used from MrNick, am I wrong?
This seems like a pretty good price to me :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by #84
I'd rather stick with the standard cast iron bomb proof manifold, it's easy to bolt on an aftermarket thats no better or worse. To actually do anything worthwhile a 4-2-1 manifold needs length (as do all manifolds worth the money) a perfect example in the pic below. There are a bundle of reasons to use this style but imo the main objective for the guys that can is to target two harmonic ranges, the production ones in the pics above are aimed at a level pretty much fitting their standard level. Start pushing the power up and the design changes.
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y85...omounting3.jpg
That is a cool design!
First: The SAAB manifolds are in principle the same as MrNicks if you reconsider the turbo location.
Secondly: 1NRO, you are perfectly right about the harmonics and that is the ultimate way to achieve the highest scavegning efficiency. But - the volume is enormous and volume kills respnse and low end performance. A bit up in the rpms performance is normally limited by engine strength (head gasket, bolts etc) or injector size / pump performance - at least on road going cars. So, with a mild turbo application (high CR) like CART or turbofication of NA engines, the design you show would be good. But for a Q4 engine used on road, it has no cahnce in overall performance.
Then: While mentioning SAAB. The head of research a few years ago is a real turbo expert, running BoostBusters as a private business. He built a system like the one in the picture on his E30 M3 EVO and if I remember it correctly the turbo was so far from the engine so it basicly was under the floor.....
I look at changing original spec as a search for power, how far you go determines the most suitable specification, true enough the one shown it pretty high end.
The method is sound but not really much of an improvement over what is already there, they designed it (saab stylie manifolds) to compliment the package and all it's production restrictions.
I know the volume is huge but I'm not thinking about manifold volume, even those long pipes will fill in a nano second, there is a turbo at the end of them afterall.
Nik
Nik, That s almost poetry: "..., there is a turbo at the end of them afterall."
But fitting such a manifold in a Q4 is a job on Houdini's level, or worse...
Ah yes, that pesky packaging. You think you have problems, the gralies are even worse.
Well, I'm talking about the 4-2-1 design, and as shown before, it?ll depend on pipe's length. Saab cast design need less room but the tubular one needs a lot more.Quote:
Originally Posted by Evodelta