View Full Version : 166 Brembo Calipers
Steve Webb
21-09-11, 08:45
Just curious as to what you guys think is a good price for a pair of Alfa 166 from calipers?
Also which models of 166 have the calipers suitable for the 305mm discs, and are these the same calipers that are suitable for 330mm discs as well?
Steve Webb
22-09-11, 16:54
No one?
I've seen a pair up at €230, is that about what other people have paid?
Hello Steve!
166 has 310mm discs and as I read somewere else at least someone has used the calipers also with 305mm discs on the Q4. So that seems to work fine.
I heard about, that 147 GTA had 305mm discs at the beginning and lateron became 330mm discs. Referring to ePER also the calipers were changed:
7189NEW POWERED FRONT BRAKE SYSTEM T?tigkeitsbeginnDAT 10-2003 (V6) DAT 12-2003 (V5)
As I drive a 166 3.0 I can try to have a look at the calipers... probably I can find out if the calipers could fit with 330mm discs.
BTW: The price in ePER from the year 2005 for ONE caliper of the 147 GTA (the big ones for 330mm discs) is around 350,- Euros.
Best regards, Martin
Steve Webb
23-09-11, 08:51
Yep the 166 caliper is quite a common upgrade for the Q4, using fiat Coupe 20vt discs as they still have the right stud pattern for the wheels. You just need an adapter plate to make the calipers fit the uprights.
Being tight with money, I'll be going for a second hand set and refurbishing them.
I think the price for a pair of calipers depends on the condition they are in.
Have seen an asking price of ?250,- and up. Some with pads and discs and some for the calipers only. On average I think they go for abuout ?300-350.
I'm thinking about to use the front Q4 calipers with discs on the rear (without ABS, one brake line to the rear and a hydraulic handbrake with manual adjusting for brake balance rear-front) and 166er brembo's on the front...
Front discs should fit at the rear without great problems...
Does anybody know, if the front calipers fit on the rear axle without mods?
Steve Webb
23-09-11, 15:12
Thought I'd move this as it seems to have gone into a tech discussion rather than about the price of the calipers.
I've never heard of anyone using std Q4 calipers on the rear, should fit under the wheels fine, but as for the calipers fitting onto the hub? No idea.
166 brembos in Slovenia are reachable from 100euros to 20euros max. 330mm discs can be fitted from mercede benz ( i dont know witch model ) with some modification.. ill check at friends catalogue for discs.. for the rear calipers it can be used caliper from vw transporter with 280mm at rear
jimnielsen
23-09-11, 22:28
I think that the 166 calipers work very well. They won't fit under some 16" wheels however..The problem with the 166 caliper / 305mm fiat VT disk is that the disks are a bit small - especially for racecars. I would really like 330 - 350mm calipers...
Colibry - if there is a 330mm disk that fits on the Q4 hub, I'd love to know which one..
I would need to move to 17 wheels however and that would involve quite a bit of guard modification...
I'd expect to pay ?120-150 for a pair of good 166 calipers in the UK...make sure you get the mounting bolts as I hear they're no longer available from Alfa (in the UK anyway!).
They were fitted to the V6 models.
wrinx
Steve Webb
24-09-11, 08:12
make sure you get the mounting bolts as I hear they're no longer available from Alfa (in the UK anyway!).
They should still be available, I thought manufacturers were obliged to carry spares for any model for 10 years after they ceased production. Since the 166 went on until 2007, spares shouldn't be a problem.
If Alfa has stopped this practice though, its an ominous sign.
Steve Webb
24-09-11, 14:17
I did look around on ebay uk for some 166 calipers but there didn't seem to be any about. Any other places good for them?
jim, 330mm brakes
http://i56.tinypic.com/28a6wed.jpg
http://i56.tinypic.com/20pahl1.jpg
http://i55.tinypic.com/sc5e2p.jpg
jimnielsen
24-09-11, 23:35
The real problem for me Jan, is that on 17" rims's I'd want to use 240mm slicks - that would be 9" rims on the rear and 8" on the front..I'd need a fair bit of guard modification to make it all work..
jim, 330mm brakes
http://i56.tinypic.com/20pahl1.jpg
:thumbsup:
What are the specs of these rims Jan?
I have the samerims and want bigger brakes also but no new rims.
330 mm is just what I am aiming at, but it needs to fit with the rims I have now.
Varypodaros
26-09-11, 17:40
don't the wheels touch the wings when you tturn the steering wheel?
Hi all!
I found following a few weeks ago...
Up to 400mm x 36mm discs with 8 piston calipers:
http://www.xyz-racing.com/index.php --> Brake Kit
or
http://www.k-sportracing-switzerland.ch/bremse_vorn_list.html
But you'll need 20" rims (perhaps they fit without rubber at all) :lol-052:
and it's a little bit expensive, I think :unsure:
jim,
i now the problem had it too as you can see in the second picture
the toyo r888's are 215/45/17 and did not fit so i'll need 205/45/17 or something, why do you want that size?
the oz wheels sometimes touch the wings, we need to make the wings wider
marc,
I asked about your wheels, but you did not respond?
Mine are et37 7inch
I asked about your wheels, but you did not respond?
That's a pitty, thanks for the trouble.
If they do respond, I'd realy like to know ;)
Mine are et37 7inch
So are mine :)
I have two different sets, also a little bit different in design.
The heart of the rim, where the centre cap are is different.
I got myself some 8J x17 (ET 28 for front and ET 25 for rear) Compomotive wheels and it will be really interesting to make them fit under my Q4.
Do you guys know what specs of tyres are good for 8J?
I have thought about 225/45 for the rear and 215/45 at front. I'm affraid that 205/45/17 on the front wheel might be too streched for the 8J rim...
Cheers.
I have thought about 225/45 for the rear and 215/45 at front.
Hi Cristian!
I don't know it exactly, how it is for the Q4!?!
About 10 years ago I had a big problem with a 33 Permanent 4.
The viscous coupling was destroyed (got a leakage and the viscous oil was lost after permanent overheating) because of different wheel diameters on front and rear.
As far as I know the Q4 has also a viscous coupling on center diff and I think that 225/45 for the rear and 215/45 at front could maybe destroy your viscous coupling!!!
I would stay at the same wheel diameter for front and rear wheels.
I would stay at the same wheel diameter for front and rear wheels.
There's something written about in the repair manual.
You need the same diameter for the front and rear!
Guys, do you mean that I should stick to same spec for TYRES for front AND rear? For ex 215/45/17 for both axles?
Or do you mean that it's a problem if front rim has ET28 and the rear one has ET25? It's only 3mm plus for the rear...
What about those who have diffrent spacers for front and rear? Like 16mm for rear and only 5mm (or none) for the front. I'm sure I've seen here this kind of wheel fitment configuration.
Cheers,
Cristian.
As far as I know you should definatly stick with the same spec in regards to circumference tyres on these cars.
However, as tyres wear out - say the rears have 8mm tread and the fronts only 2mm tread - is this safe for the viscous? Hope so as that what mine was running on!
Different spacers or different ET on front and rear doesn't effect the wheel diameter.
On the 33 there were mounted 185/60-14 on the front and 195/60-14 on the rear as I bought it. Just later on I noticed that the 4WD doesn't work anymore. I changed the viscous coupling to a functioning one and got extreme vibrations after a while of driving. I was wondering about this up to the moment I noticed the different wheels. I changed the wheels and everything was working fine...
215/45 front and 225/45 rear (tyre hight 45% of 215mm vs. 45% of 225mm) means that the diameter of rear wheels is bigger than the diameter of front wheels and there is a permanent diffence between the rotation speed of front and rear!
This can destroy the viscous coupling due to overheating!
I don't know how big or small the difference between front and rear is allowed to be?!?
I changed the wheels from front to rear and vica versa every 10.000KM's
Or you can drive it properly and change all four tyres at the same time when wornhttp://www.flitsservice.nl/phpBB/images/smilies/icon_hypocrite.gif
There you may play around a little bit with all the possibilities and you can see the differences in % and in mm:
http://www.reifensuchmaschine.de/reifen_rechner/reifenrechner.htm
It's in german language, but that should not be the problem at all. :thinking-011:
Oh I see now, I was kinda hasty and need to read some more about diffs...:tongue: ,thanks for the slap over my neck.
I will choose same tyre specs for both axles, 215/45/17 or 215/40/17/.
I will choose same tyre specs for both axles, 215/45/17 or 215/40/17/.
Hello Cristian!
I think thats a good decision for you and your Q4 dream...
Tanti Saluti, Martin
Steve Webb
11-10-11, 19:34
Hi Cristian,
The standard tyres for the Q4 are quoted as being 205/50r15, Both 215/40r17 and 215/45r17 are have a larger rolling circumference than this. The closer size would be 215/35r17 if anyone makes that size.
I use this Tyre Calculator (http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html) to work out tyre sizes.
215/45/17 seems to be too big (width and total diameter) as it gets too close to the mudguards or even touch them. The rim is already 5mm outer than the front wing's edge so I will have to go for some tight tyre, something like 205/45/17 or 215/40/17 maybe.
215/35/17 is to be considered indeed, if I'd find that kind of stuff...
Cheers,
C.
205/40/17 or 215/35/17...not 205/45/17, it's too big, 45 profiles are for the 16" option.
wrinx
I use 215/40/17 - no problems.
Tire Size Comparison
Specification Sidewall Radius Diameter Circumference Revs/Mile Difference
205/50-15 4.0in 11.5in 23.1in 72.5in 874 0.0%
215/40-17 3.4in 11.9in 23.8in 74.7in 848 3.0%
205/40-17 3.2in 11.7in 23.5in 73.7in 860 1.7%
205/45-17 3.6in 12.1in 24.3in 76.2in 831 5.2%
Incredible low profile for 205/40-17 (and so very streched especially on 8J rims) but maybe my kidnies would bare 215/40-17.
The hardest thing now would be finding good roads to run with such rims/tyres setup...:ohmy:
Thanks for every suggestion, guys! :thumb:
Cheers,
Cristian.
Does anyone know the difference between 166 and 20VT Coupe Brembo calipers if any? Are they interchangeable?
Steve Webb
16-10-11, 10:58
Well logic dictates that they would use the same calipers, but as well all know with Alfa/Fiat/Lancia this is not usually the case.
Eper has different part numbers for the Coupe 20v vt calipers and the 166 v6 calipers but that could just be down to the different arms of the company.
Also the 166 disks are 310mm and the coupe ones are 305mm.
Personally I can't see any reason for them being vastly different.
Does anyone know the difference between 166 and 20VT Coupe Brembo calipers if any? Are they interchangeable?
fiat coupe have 130mm mounting holes
166 have 150 mm mounting holes
Thats quite a difference! thanks
the other diference is in pistons
166 is with 2 42mm pistons and 2 38mm
coupe is with 4 pistons but not sure for diameter
As I drive a 166 3.0 I can try to have a look at the calipers... probably I can find out if the calipers could fit with 330mm discs.
Hi again!
I promised you to find out a little bit more on this. I took some time. :thinking-011:
I made fotos from the 166 brake during I changed to winter tyres...
And I made some drafts!
Now I think that the 166 calipers do not fit very well with 330mm discs...
because of the inner shape of the caliper (I drawed it with the dashed line) you would have to move the caliper more to the outside and so you will loose some surface of the brake pads...
The distance between the blue dashed line of caliper and the 310 brake disc is about 3mm. To reach this distance at the upper and lower end of the caliper with 330 brake disc you will have to move the caliper about 6mm to7mm away from the disc...
ALL OF THIS ARE ESTIMATIONS! I have not done any measurements!
Saluti, Martin
I did look around on ebay uk for some 166 calipers but there didn't seem to be any about. Any other places good for them?
A lot of them You can buy in Poland
http://allegro.pl/alfa-romeo-166-2-5v6-zacisk-hamulcowy-prawy-przod-i1855737294.html about 100GBP for a set
http://allegro.pl/zacisk-prawy-przod-przedni-alfa-166-2-0-v6t-brembo-i1869255009.html the same price for set
http://allegro.pl/brembo-alfa-romeo-166-v6-2-5-3-0-zaciski-hamulcowe-i1902292742.html this one is interesting as seller is making full refurb in price and can paint it a desired colour and it's included in price 180GBP for set
http://allegro.pl/zacisk-czterotloczkowy-alfa-romeo-166-komplet-i1880173169.html 105GBP for set
http://allegro.pl/alfa-romeo-166-lancia-kappa-zaciski-zacisk-brembo-i1896293800.html 125GBP for a set.
anyway after the two days reading of various posts on the forum i'm looking for a set for my q4, but first i must be able to produce somewhere brackets, or meaby someone have a spare set ?:)
best regards
I am also interested for a set of brackets.
Cheers,
C.
fiat coupe have 130mm mounting holes
166 have 150 mm mounting holes
155 Q4 has 160mm mounting holes, isn't it? Thanks.
LE: sorry, 160mm is for holes on caliper.
Cheers,
C.
Q4 have 100mm mounting holes
A lot of them You can buy in Poland
Hi Suzumushi!
Thanks for that hint! :thumb:
My uncle lives near "Warszawa". He bought it for me, because I can't speak and I can't read poslish...
I've got it already. Fotos are in my Q4 garage thread...
Now I'm going to make one bracket first out of wood in order to test the fitment. It will be based on the drawings from the "brembo threads". Thanks to all of you, guys!!! :thumbsup:
Saluti, fochista
Hi Suzumushi!
Thanks for that hint! :thumb:
My uncle lives near "Warszawa". He bought it for me, because I can't speak and I can't read poslish...
I've got it already. Fotos are in my Q4 garage thread...
Now I'm going to make one bracket first out of wood in order to test the fitment. It will be based on the drawings from the "brembo threads". Thanks to all of you, guys!!! :thumbsup:
Saluti, fochista
great to hear it was helpful :)
world is really small anyway, i can see that You are from Austria, my father lives in Vienna for about 30 years right now :)
but anyway
if anyone will need something from PL just let me know, i can help as probably i know the language quite well :D
regards
W
Steve Webb
14-12-11, 10:30
great to hear it was helpful :)
world is really small anyway, i can see that You are from Austria, my father lives in Vienna for about 30 years right now :)
but anyway
if anyone will need something from PL just let me know, i can help as probably i know the language quite well :D
regards
W
This is one of the reasons I added the members map to the forum (http://forum.berlinasportivo.com/vbgooglemapme.php) we are all a helpful bunch on here so I though it might be a good idea to know roughly where people came from in case they can help with getting hold of things.
I know some people are a little cagey about publishing where they are, so feel free to just put your marker in your home country. (hint hint) :smile:
jimnielsen
14-12-11, 20:41
I am using the 166 calipers with the 305mm fiat coupe disks. Its a good solution - vastly better than the original setup, but its still not really good enough.
If I was doing it over, i would try to use larger rotors. Maybe the 310mm 166 rotors. the other problem is heat...
I did some testing at Phillip Island at the weekend, using brake temperature paint. The outer edge of the rotor is getting up to 600 degree c. This is too hot for these calipers and rotors. The Q4 is a difficult car to add brake cooling ducting to. Especially with the brackets that support the 166 caliper.
The bottom line is that I am going to have to add some brake cooling if I want the system to perform for more than 3 - 4 laps..
Steve Webb
14-12-11, 21:36
Have you had the car weighed since you've stripped it down, be interesting to see how much weight you've been able to get rid of.
great to hear it was helpful :)
Yes, it was. A guy in austria wanted 500 Euros (for 2 calipers), :loco: not Zloty. He argumented that new ones cost about 500 Euro per piece at the Alfa Romeo local dealer...
He will own them for another few years, I think...:lol-052:
Thanks to you again!
world is really small anyway, i can see that You are from Austria, my father lives in Vienna for about 30 years right now :)
We are not that far from each other. Would be nice to meet you and your Q4 sometimes... :driving-014::smile:
if anyone will need something from PL just let me know, i can help as probably i know the language quite well :D
regards
W
Thanks for that offer. I think something could came along sometime...:thinking-011:
Tanti Saluti, Martin
Hi, guys!
Does anyone know which are the specs (length, thread) for 166 Brembo caliper's fixing screws (the big ones)? Thanks in advance.
Cheers,
Cris.
If anyone wants a set of calipers off a 166 for 180 euro plus delivery from Ireland my friend has a set for sale. Also, what brand off discs are ye running with these set ups?
I have a V6 166 myself running the standard size discs from an English company called Mtec and Ferodo DS2500 pads and they are perfectly fine, I am using just grooved discs and Castrol SRF brake fluid and have yet to experience any brake fade.
Fiat Coupe turbo...305mm iirc.
wrinx
Fiat Coupe turbo...305mm iirc.
wrinx
yep
i'm using brembos
very happy with them.
http://forum.berlinasportivo.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2003&d=1335313138
http://forum.berlinasportivo.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2021&d=1336581063
regards
DAMIENC: I have a V6 166 myself running the standard size discs from an English company called Mtec and Ferodo DS2500 pads and they are perfectly fine, I am using just grooved discs and Castrol SRF brake fluid and have yet to experience any brake fade.[/QUOTE]
I agree, I run a good quality dot 5 brake fluid and Ferodo DS2500s on the GTV and heat is not a problem in 20 minute trackday sessions. But that said the DS 2500 is just average in braking power, nothing impressive.
Damien, will your friend send the calipers to South Africa?
I can ask and see how much it is to del over there. I will give him a ring tomorrow.
The 2500's are only really a fast road pad I wouldn't be too trusting in them for the track. The best pads I've ever experienced in a car are Carbon Lorraine Cl6 pads on my 156 with 284mm discs never got an ounch of fade or loss in power but they were loud very dusty and mental money to be fair.
The 3000 Ferodo's should be better on track I would imagine.
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