adjustable top mounts [Archive] - BerlinaSportivo

arjunior45

09-03-09, 06:48

My bl@@@dy stupid STUPID mechanic forgot to tighten the front left shock absorber to its top mount and I probably need to replace the top mount - if not the shock absorber as well, we shall see next week.

I, thinking to mount a pair "adjustable top mounts" - see picture attached - and I need your experiance:
1} does someone know where I could find a pair,
or
how are they made {design - construction} so that to make a couple for myself.
and
2} will be possible to mount the styd brace above them or will I have clearance problems with the bonnet above?

Regards

Nick

arjunior45

09-03-09, 13:02

something like those will be great {looking too} but unfortunately they were made for Subaru only and I do not know if they can go on a Q4.

Nick

q4fatboy

10-03-09, 14:22

D2 units from the group buy last year

http://www.berlinasportivo.org/forumpics/d2/d203.JPG

arjunior45

10-03-09, 16:24

D2 units from the group buy last year

thats a coil over set, isn't it? Do you think that this top mount can be used with the original springs?

Did you mount them? Any photo to see the clearance in order to mount the stud brace?

Nick

mindus

10-03-09, 18:42

thats a coil over set, isn't it? Do you think that this top mount can be used with the original springs?

Did you mount them? Any photo to see the clearance in order to mount the stud brace?

Nick

Here's a picture of D2 top mount fitted in the car. Strut brace does fit perfectly with this top mount.

Have not tried it with standard shocks.

Evodelta

10-03-09, 20:26

Don't go for anything which looks like those in your first pic, they are an accident waiting to happen.

mindus

11-03-09, 17:04

AlfaJack

11-03-09, 17:34

Very nice, beautiful engineering. Do they have a price?

wrinx

11-03-09, 23:04

Check out the full thread above...some serious engineering!

wrinx

arjunior45

12-03-09, 07:25

I recently saw a nice picture on guy-croft site (http://www.guy-croft.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1421&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=15) of a top mount with adjustable both camber and caster (center part rotates). it was made for dedra, the same in on 155.

thats excellent. Thanks minbus.
I'll go for this one as I did not find any 'redy to fit' for the Q4 so far.

And I must agree with AlfaJack too.
It's a serious engineering and I love that. I believe that this top mount will compromise the ride comfort {audibly} a little, but who cares{???}. I'll try to contact this guy for drawings - dimensions.
Nice job to his head too.

I'm sending him an e-mail right now.

Nick

arjunior45

12-03-09, 10:45

well, as far as I can say, these top mounts are suitable for my purpose {is it the right word?}. The only thing that makes me worry is the 'teflon' part used where the shock absorber is fitted in the center of the bearing. I think I'll try polyurethane instead of teflon in order to have a more silent top mount. From the other hand it is very easy to pass from one material to the other.
Hope the guy to see his mail soon and answer me.

What do you think of such a mod?

Nick

arjunior45

18-03-09, 13:57

I need a favor from anyone who have mounted the D2 coil over set.

Well, the guy from the above link send me the drawings from his adjustable top mounts but unfortunately they are also for a coil over setup.
So I must modify the part where the oem spring {its 'rabber pad' / part number : 60585431} will attach to this top mound.

I do not want to keep the car in the garage for a long time and I'd like to make these adjustable top mounts before I start to remove the front suspension.

Can someone, who already have mounted the D2 kit and kept the oem top mounts, measure the internal diameter and the depth from the original/oem 'rabber pads'?

Regards

Nick

peter holst

26-03-09, 05:45

Hi nick!

if you are going to make a set - would you make one for me too? I have yellow koni dampers
I will pay you of cause

Michael_kal

26-03-09, 08:13

Hi Nick,

I will pay as well for a set I you will go to make these sets or let them make by anyone.

Regards Michael

axaQ42

26-03-09, 11:15

I'm in for that too :)

arjunior45

27-03-09, 08:52

!!!

arjunior45

27-03-09, 08:56

guys, thanks for the interest.
But I must tell you that these top mounts will take a while to be completed.
First of all because I have not that free time to deal with.
Secondly, the drawings are for a coil over set and I do not know how they will fit with the oem springs. I might have to modify them to 'lock' in position the oem springs.
But, the most important is my concern about the ride high using these top mounts. I need to make a pair first, fit them in the car and check the ride high.

I've sent the drawings to a friend of mine in Thessaloniki and I'm waiting for his reply. He insists on making them out of aeronautical comp alu {70/70} and use uniball instead of the 'original' drawings for bearings. I was expecting a reply last weekend but I have not heard anything from him yet. Neither he nor I am in a hurry, so probably it's a project for the ... summer time.

As soon as they are ready I’ll let you know.

Nick

peter holst

27-03-09, 17:44

Hi nick!

bad luck for all of us...

what about my q regarding uniball suspension points?

can you help me ?

regards

peter

arjunior45

28-03-09, 05:28

Hi nick!

bad luck for all of us...

what about my q regarding uniball suspension points?

can you help me ?

regards

peter

sorry peter,
its the same argument with the adj top mounts.
I need the time to deal with these parts and {believe it or not} I can not find the free - spare time to deal with.

This Q4 is my wife's everyday car and she asks for the Bertone if I'm going to block the car in the garage. Last time she drove the Bertone was a disaster! Took me a year or more to remake its engine after a spin versus a Porsche 911 Turbo. And it was less than 1 Km to travel back home.

sorry

Nick

peter holst

28-03-09, 06:44

I do understand the thing about wife and finding time - same problem here.
I will buy a coilover set.
Is there any chance that your mecanic can help with the uniball-thing (making them or may be he has the drawings??)

1NRO

28-03-09, 09:08

Anyone with a picture of the o/e bush and carrier? Maybe even the centres?

Nik

peter holst

30-03-09, 11:29

hi Nik!

are you the guy that are going to save me?

arjunior45

30-03-09, 14:44

o/e bush and carrier

Nik

what's this?

Nick

1NRO

30-03-09, 19:10

This is an original front suspension bush off the integrales http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/LANCIA-DELTA-INTEGRALE-EVO-FRONT-SUSPENSION-BUSH-NEW_W0QQitemZ370170300440QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Car sParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item370170300440&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1683%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C 240%3A1318

If someone can post a picture of what's fitted to the 155's I can see if they are anything too complex or not. Ideally a picture of the wishbone on the floor with the bushes separated from it in the same pic. It's hard to see the finer details in the manual.

Nik

arjunior45

31-03-09, 07:03

sorry Nik,
I can't help you with this - not a clue how they are, nor any photo.

Nick

1NRO

31-03-09, 11:14

I've had a look through google images but nothing too great to look at. It does look possible but I'm not sure what holds the bushes on the arms? Is it a case of once bolted onto the subframe bushs and wishbone are held securely?

Nik

AlfaJack

31-03-09, 11:38

The bushes are bonded on to the wishbones, they need burning off. The bushes have the clamp that bolts to the subframe wrapped round the bush.

wrinx

31-03-09, 17:26

If someone can post a picture of what's fitted to the 155's I can see if they are anything too complex or not. Ideally a picture of the wishbone on the floor with the bushes separated from it in the same pic. It's hard to see the finer details in the manual.

Nik

Does THIS (http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/arocderbyshire/alfaromeo155/index_page/05_Technical/3_wishbone_bushes.htm) help?

wrinx

1NRO

31-03-09, 18:53

It looks do-able, theres even plenty of length in the origional bush to allow for spacers tailored for castor adjustment. The problem for me is I don't have a full subframe and wishbone set to work off, it's too big a risk to do it without the hands on reference.

I have to wonder if there was a real need to do fit such an item (if you could get them) unless you were taking the car to high levels. The poly bush route would be a good step forward and ample for most people surely?

Anyone that fancies the work I'm happy to offer advice on the design route or if someone could land a setup on my doorstep I'd do the design if it was possible to ensure the strength needed.

Nik

peter holst

31-03-09, 19:45

hi Nik!

where in the world do you live?

wrinx

31-03-09, 20:06

The poly bush route would be a good step forward and ample for most people surely?

I'd have thought so, this seems a massive step forward...will it make that much difference???

wrinx

1NRO

31-03-09, 22:32

Hi Peter,

I live in the UK, north west England.

Nik

1NRO

31-03-09, 22:38

I'd have thought so, this seems a massive step forward...will it make that much difference???

wrinx

If you want to set the car up to be dialed in perfectly and intend using it in competition then yes it is worth it but for the day to day use on public roads no it isn't.

It's overkill but thats not stopped me in the past :tasty:

Nik

peter holst

01-04-09, 06:12

hi nik!

I am going to put my new engine in soon and could send my subframe etc to you but I think it would be cheeper fot me to pay you for an subframe from an 2.0 alfa in UK. Is it possible to understand what I am saying?
would you be interested in doing it?
my hole projekt is overkill so I might as well continue

peter

1NRO

01-04-09, 07:36

Hi Peter,

Yes, I understand you fine. I'm rushing out now to go to work but will write tonight. Where in the world are you?

Nik

jimnielsen

01-04-09, 07:55

I am interested in a rose jointed front wishbone system as well. I have the poly bush system now - but its still pretty sloppy.

jimn~

peter holst

01-04-09, 08:38

denmark

1NRO

01-04-09, 21:40

Peter,

I've had a think on the subject and it is feasible. It may be impossible when i have the parts in front of me. It hinges on being able to provide a strong enough housing for the bearing without catching on the subframe (looks to be the smallest area of clearance) and internal diameters that are left for the bearings that would suit the purpose.

If you can give me a few days to see if there are any 155's local to be (ideally in a scrap yard) I'll be able to have a better opinion then. I'll get back to you soon.

I should mention I require a bit of time for these kind of projects to reach completion, it's not my full time occupation. I'm not looking to achieve huge profit margins but you do understand these kind of components cost quite a bit of money. For example the bearings fitted to my Delta kit cost ?130 before anything else was done, they are good ones though, Aurora.

For now,

Nik

RMB-Racing

01-04-09, 21:41

Well, I think the hole project is beginning to take form, so I will join it too.

I?m going to convert my car to a rallycar, so for me its not a overkill, at all!

Thanks to you Peter, for being so persistent to hold this project alive. :smile:

arjunior45

02-04-09, 07:51

well, if you are going to use the Q4 as a rallycar you should keep your mods under the FIA homologation restrictions. And you need this homologation to be certain of what you can do and what you can NOT.

If you want just a suspension upgrade for your fun, you can do whatever you want!

When I brought the car for alignment I was told that Integrales have adjustable rear axle!!! Q4s does not.
Did anyone consider this possibility - probability?
It's a thought and I would like to know if it's possible.
Maybe 1NRO could help us with this.

Nick

peter holst

02-04-09, 09:42

hi Nik!

I know that it cost money so no problem

peter holst

02-04-09, 09:44

interesting!

1NRO

02-04-09, 16:05

The picture below is my track car that now is adjustable at all the mounting points but the o/e traverse arms nearest the front are adjustable on threaded bushs.
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y85/1NRO/IMG_1835.jpg
What's the setup on a 155?

1NRO

06-04-09, 20:49

Ok, I found a 155 in a scrap yard local to me. The rear bush is possible to remake in a sperical bearing block but the front one isn't. It might be possible but I don't fancy the chances. The centre pivot point of the front mounting is too close to the subframe to allow for a bearing and a casing to hold it. Likely it would be possible if time was no problem and if the determination was strong enough but for a straight replacement without altering geometry it's not possible. So its a nearly but not quite, sorry fella's.

Nik